From: Darby Weaver (darbyweaver@yahoo.com)
Date: Tue Apr 17 2007 - 10:28:11 ART
Not if one reads very carefully.
--- Scott Morris <smorris@ipexpert.com> wrote:
> So in other words this is study with a margin of
> error in the +/- 3000%
> range then.
>
> Statistics are always interesting creatures, but
> ones that should be put in
> proper cages.
>
> :)
>
>
> Scott Morris, CCIE4 (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/Service
> Provider) #4713, JNCIE
> #153, CISSP, et al.
> CCSI/JNCI-M/JNCI-J
> IPexpert VP - Curriculum Development
> IPexpert Sr. Technical Instructor
> smorris@ipexpert.com
> http://www.ipexpert.com
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nobody@groupstudy.com
> [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On Behalf Of
> Darby Weaver
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 9:03 AM
> To: Sean.Zimmerman@clubcorp.com;
> ccielab@groupstudy.com
> Subject: Re: Close but no Cigar (You Asked - the
> Vendor Bakeoff)
>
> Sean,
>
> Here's some "digits" for you just pulled from each
> vendor's website:
>
> To be fair - I started with late February to start
> the numbers from - recall
> some vendors have 10 years and some have less years.
>
>
> ====================================================
>
> Now I picked on Nick Griffin and used his number
> since he passed in Late
> February as a baseline to grab these numbers - and
> since he is on the roster
> of more than a couple of vendors. (No offense Nick)
>
> The truth is - it is hard to tell who made the
> difference with each
> candidate since many use a lot of materials from
> different vendors and each
> vendor claims each CCIE who purchased their
> materials.
>
> Now each vendor may also have other CCIE's who did
> not "call in" their
> number as well so it could be listed - I cannot
> account for that since it is
> not listed.
>
> Some vendors sell their products cheaply and thus
> have a higher market share
> as well and this is not reflected - think ratio.
>
> Some trainers/vendors do not list or it is hard to
> find their current CCIE's
> (like IEMentor) - sorry.
>
> Some trainers cannot post ther students or don't
> post their students (say
> like Paul Borghese for instance who can probably
> claim a lot if the GS list
> itself counts at all).
>
> Lots of things to consider.
>
> It also does not consider how much help a candidate
> may have recived from
> others or vendors on GS, some vendors and their
> employees do quite a bit on
> GS to answer lingering questions and sometimes very
> critical specific
> questions and scenarios.
>
> I can say that you need to read my posts and look at
> this list from the past
> 2 months or so and draw your own conclusions - some
> said I was biased - the
> numbers are what they are.
>
> Remember there is no accounting for ratio, but if
> ratio were important to
> you, you would be well-advised to look twice or even
> three times if you
> missed a very simple fact.
>
> So when you see class-only or one-on-one it is hard
> but there classes and
> tutelege are sparse and they rarely have large
> classes to draw success
> stories from.
>
> If three go in and three come out CCIE's, what can I
> tell you.
>
> And there's a training center in China called
> www.ccxx.net with several
> month programs of study that simply builds CCIE's
> eventually.
>
> Oh yes - I did not count anyone I (or others) may
> have worked with - wink
> wink... You know who you are. :)
>
> No accounting for personal study friends or
> study-groups either.
>
> ==============================================
>
> 1. IE - 21 CCIE's (Assumes RS) WB/Class/COD/More
>
> 2. NMC - 12 CCIE's (Assumes RS) WB/Class/Some
> COD/Book
>
> 3. HU - 10 CCIE's (Assumes RS) (No Workbook Just
> In-Class)
>
> 4. NLI / CCBOOTCAMP - 5 RS / 3 Voice (Hot for
> Voice)WB/Class/Mini-WorkBooks/More
>
> 5. IPEXPERT - 3 RS and 1 Voice WB/Class/COD/More
>
> 6. CyscoExpert - 3 RS (One-on-One Training)
>
>
> =============================================
>
> IE: 21 (some are listed with other vendors)
>
> #17746 Joselito Nunez
> #17623 Craig Middlebrooks
> #17613 Jerald Hulbert
> #17610 Antonio Martin
> #17590 Mark Rushby
> #17582 Mandebis Ably
> #17561 Luqman Kondeth
> #17559 Ram Patla
> #17518 Andre Serrao
> #17516 Clifton Folkerts
> #17474 Kemal Haydar
> #17471 Colm O'Leary
> #17457 Robert Watson
> #17447 Vlaho Jemin
> #17439 Michael Marran
> #17409 Jim White
> #17403 Vladimir Starovatov
> #17401 Jeff Stevenson
> #17390 Abhi Gupta
> #17389 Luke Lambert
> #17381 Nick Griffin
>
>
> NMC: 12 RS
>
> Joselito Nunez CCIE# 17746
> Craig Middlebrooks CCIE# 17623
> Jerald Hulbert CCIE# 17613
> Mandebis Ably CCIE# 17582
> Luqman Kondeth CCIE# 17561
> Andre Serrao CCIE# 17518
> Terry Smith CCIE# 17499
> Aaron Aday CCIE# 17475
> Prio Utomo CCIE# 17431
> Peter Mesjar CCIE# 17428
> Marcel Roy CCIE# 17418
> Nick Griffin CCIE# 17381
>
>
> IPExpert: 3 RS and 1 Voice
>
> Andre Serrao CCIE #17518 (R&S)
> Peter Mesjar CCIE #17428 (R&S)
> Alejandro Alejo CCIE #17391 (Voice)
> Nick Griffin CCIE #17381 (R&S)
>
>
> CCBOOTCAMP: 5 RS / 3 Voice
>
> Luqman Kondeth 17561 (R&S)
> Sebastian Pasternacki 17541 (R&S)
> Robert Hugo 17494 (Voice)
> Robert Watson 17457 (R&S)
> Jim White 17409 (R&S)
> Alejandro Alejo 17391 (Voice)
> Nick Griffin 17381 (R&S)
>
>
> HU: (Note no workbooks - only classes and some with
> only 1 or 2 students)
> 10
>
> 17409, 17470, 17517, 17540, 17612, 17637, 17651,
> 17652, 17711, 17746
>
> CyscoExpert: 3 RS? (One-on-One Training)
>
> Terry Smith, CCIE #17499
> Clifton Folkerts, CCIE #17516
> Wageh Eid, CCIE #17569
>
> --- Sean.Zimmerman@clubcorp.com wrote:
>
> > Just found out at 1:00 AM this morning that I
> failed my third attempt
> > at San Jose. I'm tempted to submit for a reread,
> but I'm a little
> > discouraged by that 0.5% statistic. Yesterday's
> lab seemed easy, I
> > only had to skip 5 points worth of sections and I
> finished about an
> > hour early. I really thought that I'd nailed it. I
> wasn't certain
> > about a
> > 2 point category, but
> > it turned out that I got it based on my score
> report, so based off my
> > point tracking, I should've scored with a 95%.
> Less than 80% seemed
> > impossible.
> >
> > I'm thinking about trying a different workbook.
> I'm using IPExpert V9
> > right now, and I don't have the proctor guide.
> I've been flying
> > through (most of) those labs, and my configs match
> the final configs.
> > Nothing against IPExpert, but I think it would be
> good to change the
> > scene just a little. I attended an IPExpert
> bootcamp with the infamous
> > and extremely knowledgeable Scott Morris back in
> November, and I've
> > heard that you're supposed to use a different
> Vendor's workbook than
> > the one providing the bootcamp. I'm considering IE
> or NM, anyone have
> > any recommendations? I'm strongly considering IE
> because it includes
> > the solutions/proctor guide and they seem to be
> listing a lot of
> > CCIE's right now.
> >
> >
>
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