From: Joe Cordoba (cordoba@cistron.nl)
Date: Fri Sep 27 2002 - 17:33:09 GMT-3
Nice conversation.
Talking to a CCIE about half a year ago. He recommended me no to worry
about the exam. It is kind of funny that I read a peace of advice from
Jeff Doyle. He stated that job experience was not enough to pass a lab.
Man but hands on at my job is what I do everyday and If I can handle my
work I can handle any CISCO technology. I don't think it is completely
necessary to prove in a lab something that you don't even work with
everyday. And that you will eventually forget. As long as you do a good
job your manager will be happy. But haven't said that I will still
pursue the CCIE lab as it just proves that I was able to reach the LAB
level.
Best regards,
Joe Cordoba
Chuck Church wrote:
>Scot,
>
> Couldn't agree with you more. And I thought preparing for the lab
>itself was challenging. You've got two NDA's to contend with :) Best of
>luck in the coming months/weeks/days???
>
>Chuck Church
>CCIE #8776, MCNE, MCSE
>Sr. Network Engineer
>Magnacom Technologies
>140 N. Rt. 303
>Valley Cottage, NY 10989
>845-267-4000
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com]On Behalf Of
>Wilson Scot Capt AFCA/GCF
>Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 2:54 PM
>To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
>Subject: RE: MS-CCIE
>
>
>Here is the reason why we have network engineers w/ CCIE and network
>managers with no real hands-on and troubleshooting ability. Let's face it,
>we are techy geeks who care more about OSPF then about how a company earns
>money. I got a war and a CCIE lab to prepare for, lets keep it real...
>technical.
>
>Scot
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: elping [mailto:elpingu@acedsl.com]
>Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 6:58 PM
>To: certstudy
>Cc: rich; albert_lu@optushome.com.au; 'Meyer, J. (Johan)'; 'Tim Ross';
>ccielab@groupstudy.com
>Subject: Re: MS-CCIE
>
>
>my thoughs ..
>
>cisco does make a profit..
>all the racks and equipment is paid for ......they are tasting the gravy now
>
>certstudy wrote:
>
>
>
>>you guys think Cisco actually makes a profit from any of the fees it
>>
>>
>charges
>
>
>>for any of the certs. do some math. there are probably a few dozen
>>
>>
>people
>
>
>>employed by the ccie program--half of them ccie level people. then there
>>
>>
>is
>
>
>>equipment (pc's, racks, cabling). whatever cisco charges them for their
>>space on cco, their rent, etc. etc.
>>
>>at one time i thought that they were making money off the fees but do the
>>math. anyway, the real profits from the certifications are by having a
>>
>>
>well
>
>
>>trained and prepared support infrastructure.
>>
>>anybody try to get a question answered by linksys or d-link lately. too
>>small? how about avaya, expanets or lucent??
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "rich" <rich@pixguru.com>
>>To: <albert_lu@optushome.com.au>; "'Meyer, J. (Johan)'"
>><JohanMe@nedcor.com>; "'Tim Ross'" <ross2k@pclv.com>;
>><ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>>Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 7:53 AM
>>Subject: Re: MS-CCIE
>>
>>
>>
>>>Have you seen their lab? The one in San Jose doubles as a storage
>>>
>>>
>>closet..
>>
>>
>>>It's well organized, but NOT data center like at all..
>>>
>>>10 people a day at San Jose
>>>That's $12,500 a day. Not bad for one proctor and their own assets.
>>>
>>>
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Albert Lu" <albert_lu@optushome.com.au>
>>>To: "'Meyer, J. (Johan)'" <JohanMe@nedcor.com>; "'Tim Ross'"
>>><ross2k@pclv.com>; "'rich'" <rich@pixguru.com>; <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>>>Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 4:14 AM
>>>Subject: RE: MS-CCIE
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Actually from what I was told by a proctor, cisco doesn't really make
>>>>
>>>>
>>that
>>
>>
>>>>much money from CCIE lab exams. Since they have to pretty much have a
>>>>
>>>>
>>mini
>>
>>
>>>>24x7 data centre for the lab with raised floors, ups, air
>>>>
>>>>
>conditioning,
>
>
>>>>power, rent, also salaries for proctors, plus not all labs are always
>>>>
>>>>
>>>booked
>>>
>>>
>>>>out. I've always thought that cisco would be making a killing with the
>>>>
>>>>
>>lab
>>
>>
>>>>exams, but having worked in a datacentre in my past life I could
>>>>
>>>>
>imagine
>
>
>>>how
>>>
>>>
>>>>all those costs could really add up.
>>>>
>>>>Albert Lu
>>>>CCIE #8705
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com]On Behalf Of
>>>>Meyer, J. (Johan)
>>>>Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 5:18 PM
>>>>To: 'Tim Ross'; rich; ccielab@groupstudy.com
>>>>Subject: RE: MS-CCIE
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Lets look at the BIG Picture!!
>>>>
>>>>Cisco is a Successful aggresive Bussiness so I dont think they will
>>>>
>>>>
>>limit
>>
>>
>>>>this certification.
>>>>It brings in a span of money!
>>>>That is why it was changed from a 2 day to a 1 day LAB as before when
>>>>
>>>>
>>they
>>
>>
>>>>could schedule
>>>>max 2 labs a week they can now have 6 .Thats 3 times the revenue than
>>>>before!!
>>>>What succesful Bussiness man would turn that down!!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Johan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: Tim Ross [mailto:ross2k@pclv.com]
>>>>Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 8:40 AM
>>>>To: rich; ccielab@groupstudy.com
>>>>Subject: Re: MS-CCIE
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I'm not sure I get the point either. In your post you said you have
>>>>experience, and got in the business for the money, yet you did not
>>>>
>>>>
>>become
>>
>>
>>>a
>>>
>>>
>>>>CCIE when you could make a lot of money by being a CCIE. Now that the
>>>>
>>>>
>>job
>>
>>
>>>>market is not so good for CCIE's you want to become a CCIE. Also,
>>>>
>>>>
>>please
>>
>>
>>>do
>>>
>>>
>>>>not start limiting the number of CCIEs per country until after I pass.
>>>>Thanks.
>>>>
>>>>Happy studying,
>>>>Tim
>>>>
>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: "rich" <rich@pixguru.com>
>>>>To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>>>>Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2002 6:43 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: MS-CCIE
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Could you possibly miss the point any more?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>>From: "Tom Larus" <tlarus@cox.net>
>>>>>To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>>>>>Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2002 6:54 AM
>>>>>Subject: MS-CCIE
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>If the CCIE is not worth much these days, and you are in it
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>primarily
>>
>>
>>>>for
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>money, and you already have a good job, and respect, and know so
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>much
>>
>>
>>>>more
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>than those "lab rat" CCIEs, just stop pursuing the CCIE.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You don't need it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You should stand pat on your experience and be comfortable in
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>knowing
>>
>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>years of experience will always trump demonstrated intelligence.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tom Larus, CCIE #10,014
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>From: "rich" <rich@pixguru.com>
>>>>>>To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 9:04 PM
>>>>>>Subject: MS-CCIE
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>A couple of years ago, at the height of the dot com era, a CCIE
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>in
>
>
>>>my
>>>
>>>
>>>>>area
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>could easily pull in 150k. Did I start down this road for the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>money?
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>Hell
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>yes. I already had field experience, a good job, seniority,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>respect,
>>>
>>>
>>>>>and
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>all
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>that stuff that makes work fun. Besides, CCIE would be a
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>challenge.
>>
>>
>>>>>But
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>a
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>LOT has changed in the past couple of years. Bad economy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>Fewer
>
>
>>>>jobs.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>Lowered salaries. And apparently a butt load of CCIE's! I mean
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>wow!
>>>
>>>
>>>>>And
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>hear that many of them are just lab ccie's really brings the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>8000+
>
>
>>>>>CCIE's
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>into
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>a different light. It brings my own efforts into the same
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>light.
>
>
>>>It
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>reminds
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>me of what happened to Novell certifications... I had just
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>gotten
>
>
>>my
>>
>>
>>>>CNE
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>when
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I heard the term 'paper CNE' about a guy at the same company who
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>carried
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>cue
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>cards around to customers with commands written on them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I haven't gotten my ccie yet but I'm hoping to. My chances
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>would
>
>
>>>>>probably
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>be
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>greatly enhanced by going to a boot-camp, but I feel that would
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>just
>>
>>
>>>>add
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>the problem. Maybe limiting the number of active CCIE's in a
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>country
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>would
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>keep the certification from getting too bloated. Or maybe just
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>stop
>>
>>
>>>>the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>certification process now or at a fixed number. Or better yet,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>allow
>>>
>>>
>>>>no
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>more
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>than 1000 a year (total) to be certified. Candidate selection
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>process
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>could
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>be a weighted drawing (increased chances every year).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'm not trying to criticize anyone's efforts, but rather express
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>the
>>
>>
>>>>>>results
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>of those efforts. It's kind of liking moving into a new, quiet,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>expensive
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>neighborhood. It's great until everyone else moves in, and
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>suddenly
>>
>>
>>>>>that
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>expensive house isn't worth what you paid for it.
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