From: Gary Duncanson (gary.duncanson@googlemail.com)
Date: Tue Aug 21 2007 - 15:42:44 ART
Makes sense.
Thanks David.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Prall" <dcp@dcptech.com>
To: "'Scott Vermillion'" <scott_ccie_list@it-ag.com>;
<ccielab@groupstudy.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 5:58 PM
Subject: RE: Virtual CCIE's? - 3550/3560
> SIMICS is hardware emulation. It actually emulates the processors and
> asics.
> Putting together a switch would be rather difficult unless you worked for
> Cisco since the ASIC's are proprietary and the processor to asic linkage
> is
> part of the design. Also a license for Simics is rather expensive.
> Packages
> like this are typically used in the design phase, since an ASIC can be
> simulated rather easily, where as having it produced for debugging
> purposes
> can take months. So the software emulation of hardware is well worthwhile
> during the design phase.
>
> --
> http://dcp.dcptech.com
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] On
>> Behalf Of Scott Vermillion
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 12:28 PM
>> To: ccielab@groupstudy.com
>> Subject: RE: Virtual CCIE's? - 3550/3560
>>
>> The good news is that they appear to offer an "academic" license for
>> individual use (approval time ~1 week). The bad news is that when I
>> google "virtutech cisco switch," I come up with precious
>> little. Here is
>> a link to a presentation where Cisco is mentioned in passing:
>>
>> http://www.deserec.eu/files/first_workshop/pdf/DESEREC_IABG_Si
>> mics_Workshop_2006.pdf
>>
>> It may indeed be possible to emulate a Cisco switch, but it
>> appears as if
>> there exists no "Dynagen equivalent" for we mere mortals. And no real
>> history to indicate CPU/memory requirements (could you
>> emulate one switch
>> with a given hardware configuration or could you emulate
>> 12?). Certainly
>> there doesn't appear to be any "body of knowledge" out there.
>> Also, not
>> sure how to take it, but that presentation makes mention of only being
>> able to bridge "TCP and UDP" from the simulated environment
>> to a physical
>> NIC (so no control plane traffic directly over IP? etc?). Thus, I'll
>> keep my ear to the ground on this one, but I still plan to
>> spend the next
>> several months tackling the CCIE R&S lab vs. being one of the first to
>> figure SIMICS and Cisco switches out...
>>
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: RE: Virtual CCIE's? - 3550/3560
>> From: "Lamine BOUAFIA" <b_lamine@yahoo.fr>
>> Date: Tue, August 21, 2007 6:48 am
>> To: <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>>
>> Anyone who know mode about
>> http://www.virtutech.com/products/ and how
>> to
>> simulate Cisco 3550/3560??
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> -----Message d'origine-----
>> De : nobody@groupstudy.com [mailto:nobody@groupstudy.com] De la part
>> de
>> Brian Dennis
>> Envoyi : mardi 21 ao{t 2007 06:42
>> @ : Scott Vermillion; Cisco certification
>> Objet : [Bulk] RE: Virtual CCIE's?
>>
>> When teaching a class at Cisco recently one of the students
>> said that
>> the
>> 3550 or 3560 can be "virtualized" using software from this company:
>>
>> http://www.virtutech.com/products/
>> https://www.simics.net/
>>
>> Personally I never looked into it but someone here may be familiar
>> with
>> the software and it's capabilities.
>>
>> Brian Dennis, CCIE4 #2210 (R&S/ISP-Dial/Security/SP)
>> bdennis@internetworkexpert.com
>>
>> Internetwork Expert, Inc.
>> http://www.InternetworkExpert.com
>> Toll Free: 877-224-8987
>> Direct: 775-745-6404 (Outside the US and Canada)
>>
>> >----- Original Message -----
>> Subject: RE: Virtual CCIE's?
>> Date: Mon, August 20, 2007 21:30
>> From: "Scott Vermillion" <scott_ccie_list@it-ag.com>
>>
>> > Unfortunately, the more recent posts I've seen from him would
>> indicated
>> > that, due largely to ASICs that cannot easily be
>> reverse-engineered, a
>> > switch equivalent or extension is all but dead as a concept. This
>> is why
>> > I chose to go ahead and purchase some 3560-8PCs and just
>> move on...
>> >
>> > -------- Original Message --------
>> > Subject: Re: Virtual CCIE's?
>> > From: "darth router" <darklordrouter@gmail.com>
>> > Date: Mon, August 20, 2007 9:18 pm
>> > To: ISolveSystems <support@isolvesystems.com>
>> > Cc: "Scott Vermillion" <scott_ccie_list@it-ag.com>, "Cisco
>> > certification" <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>> >
>> > That depends on the devs, and if they can continue to support
>> future
>> > platforms, whether it is possible or feasible. No switches yet,
>> maybe
>> > never, but who knows, chris has some posts where he wanted access
>> to
>> > 6500 switches. Might be workin on it :P I hope so. Here
>> is the site
>> > with the history.
>> >
>> > http://www.ipflow.utc.fr/index.php/Cisco_7200_Simulator
>> >
>> > On 8/21/07, ISolveSystems <support@isolvesystems.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > You said that Dynamips is in its infancy. I am curious to know
>> > how old is
>> > Dynamips? How do you see the continuing development of Dynamips
>> > to support
>> > future IOS development?
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> >
>> > On 8/20/07, Scott Vermillion < scott_ccie_list@it-ag.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Gregory,
>> > >
>> > > Were a person to acquire the CCIE cert w/ nothing more than
>> > time on
>> > > Dynamips, that person may indeed face a few embarrassing
>> > moments
>> > > early on. So it should be outlawed and shunned by the
>> > CCIE-seeking
>> > > community at large? I'd wager that 90% or better using
>> > Dynamips for
>> > > CCIE study have sufficient experience w/ real HW to know
>> > which side
>> > > the power switch is on.
>> > & gt;
>> > > Do you think you'll normally have physical access to all of
>> > the
>> > > routers on which you are expected to perform your work? If
>> > you
>> > > require that to do your job, are you effective?
>> > >
>> > > Recall that this is real IOS -- not some training
>> > simulator. So the
>> > > chassis, the power supply, the interface cards, etc. are
>> > lacking in
>> > > your CCIE lab, where you are intensely focused on subtle
>> > protocol
>> > > interplay. So? Can you even touch the HW during the CCIE
>> > practical
>> > > exam?
>> > >
>> > > I have posted this as recently as a few hours ago on the
>> > professional
>> > > board:
>> > >
>> > > "I have now been dealing with Dynamips since (roughly) Dec of
>> > last
>> > > year. I generally trust it (yes, bugs now and then and even
>> > the
>> > > occasional crash, but can IOS itself claim otherwise?) and
>> > actually
>> > > prefer it over real hardware for a couple of reasons:
>> > >
>> > > 1. Recabling a HW lab takes longer than launching a new .net
>> > file. I
>> > > keep every .net file I've ever created, along with all of the
>> > router
>> > > NVRAM files, etc. Modifying one lab for another purpose gets
>> > easier
>> > > and easier as your collection grows. Take good notes on why
>> > you
>> > > created a given environment and your results. This becomes a
>> > highly
>> > > valuable reference resource when you've grown a little fuzzy
>> > on some
>> > > details of a prior battle.
>> > >
>> > > 2. The capture function of Dynagen is killer. Definitely
>> > beats debug
>> > > output when you're really trying to understand what's going
>> > on under
>> > > the hood. If you're proficient w/ Wireshark or any other PA
>> > that can
>> > > open a .cap file, this is a "ki ller app" for sur e."
>> > >
>> > > Dynamips is nothing short of revolutionary for understanding,
>> > > troubleshooting, prototyping, and generally poking and
>> > prodding
>> > > network-related protocols. It has some limitations, yet in
>> > its
>> > > infancy. Know those and live with them. And then leverage a
>> > tool
>> > > that can only be bested by some seriously deep pockets...
>> > >
>> > > Regards,
>> > >
>> > > Scott
>> > >
>> > > -------- Original MessageGr --------
>> > > Subject: Virtual CCIE's?
>> > > From: "Gregory Gombas" < ggombas@gmail.com>
>> > > Date: Mon, August 20, 2007 6:19 pm
>> > > To: "Cisco certification" <ccielab@groupstudy.com>
>> > >
>> > > Guys,
>> > >
>> > > I was checking out Dynamips and its pretty cool and all,
>> > but it
>> > > does
>> > > worry me a little bit....
>> > >
>> > > How will employers view the CCIE certification after
>> > they've been
>> > > burned by hiring a CCIE who has never touched a real router
>> > in
>> > > their
>> > > life?
>> > >
>> > > Do you like the idea of a pilot flying your plane whose
>> > only
>> > > training
>> > > was with a virtual flight simulator?
>> > >
>> > > ; I remember the days when the MCSE was a hot cert until an
>> > army of
>> > > paper CCIE's hit the job market.
>> > >
>> > > Maybe they won't call it a paper CCIE, maybe they'll coin a
>> > new
>> > > term
>> > > like virtual CCIE.
>> > >
>> > > Just food for thought...
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
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>>
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